Behind the Behavior

Information on Dog, Cat, and Bird Behavior from Companion Animal Solutions

KOMO-TV Interviews Me About Cesar Millan

Jim Ha, PhD, CAABKOMO-TV Cesar Milan

It’s been an interesting week.  Last Friday, a local trainer and colleague, Grisha Stewart of Ahimsa Dog Training contacted me to ask if I would discuss Cesar Millan’s techniques with a reporter from KOMO-TV here in Seattle. To see video of the piece broadcast by KOMO-TV, click here, or click on the image to the right. Millan was in town for a meet-and-greet and fundraiser for a local pet shelter.  I leaped at the chance, as the science that I do as an ethologist very much clashes with his approaches, and I have been working hard to get the word out to the public about the serious side effects of his techniques.

In our practice, we see MANY cases of dogs with severe aggression, and in performing our detailed background interviews and assessments, we find that the dog has gotten worse following treatment with behavior modification techniques similar to those of Millan’s, whether administered by the owner, based on what they think that they know of the methods, or administered by local trainers who use similar techniques.  These cases elegantly support what we already know from the science of animal behavior, called ethology.

What are Millan’s techniques?  They involve a combination of exhaustion, flooding, and a very traditional use of aversive learning, more commonly called punishment.  What is lacking from his approaches is any sort of positive social interaction, rewarding of proper behavior, “positive affect” as it is called by the psychologists.

Exhaustion as a behavior modification technique is now being debated for its role in anti-terrorist torture techniques, and we know from decades of learning research that exhaustion actually decreases learning.  Flooding as a useful technique in humans has lost its adherents due to its potentially negative side-effects and its ineffectiveness: a vaguely similar but much more useful technique is called desensitization.  Flooding is basically the process of “breaking” an animal (or human), a technique now also rapidly losing favor in the horse training world.  Finally, Millan makes heavy use of punishment, but which he, completely incorrectly, describes as being part of dog pack dominance behavior.

We know that the use of any one of these techniques will produce fear, anxiety, and a well-documented phenomenon known as “learned helplessness.”  Learned helplessness is a psychological condition in which a human being or an animal has learned to act or behave helpless in a particular situation, even when it has the power to change its unpleasant or even harmful circumstance. Learned helplessness theory is the view that clinical depression and related mental illnesses result from a perceived absence of control over the outcome of a situation (Seligman, 1975).  This condition has been heavily researched, originally by Seligman’s group at Cornell University.  It is one of the conditions we see in post-traumatic stress disorder (a similar condition from which many of the “badly behaved” dogs that are brought to Millan, and to our practice, are suffering), and it is what we see in many of the animals that have been handled using Millan’s techniques.

It’s also interesting to note that we biologists, ethologists, studying the behavior of animals in the world around us would NEVER be allowed to apply the techniques that Millan uses to the crows, primates, killer whales, and other animals that we find so fascinating… and we wouldn’t want to: these techniques tell us nothing and do not help us learn any more about our fellow wildlife.

Given that we know that any of these techniques can produce horrible side-effects, one of the worst things about Millan’s approach is that he combines the use of all three.  For these reasons, because we know so much more about dog behavior than Cesar Millan fans realize, because the use of these techniques, especially when we know better, is unethical, I was happy to speak to the KOMO reporter.

As always in the our world, everything is not black-and-white: will Millan’s techniques produce a change in the behavior of a dog, a decrease in aggression in the specific context in which he does the training and in the trainer’s presence?  Yup… and we see that on the National Geographic Channel.  But at the cost of what severe long-term and side-effect consequences, which we do not see on the National Geographic Channel?

Do I suggest in my own work that many a dog’s problems arise from boredom and lack of exercise, especially younger dogs and those bred for high energy, and do I therefore recommend a greatly expanded exercise program, even training your dog to (voluntarily) run on a treadmill?  Yup… but note the voluntary part!

Do some breeds require a clear social structure and “get into trouble” without it, and do I therefore sometimes recommend affirming and clarifying a social structure, using proper social communication signals that dogs recognize?  Yup, but notice the part about “some breeds” and proper social signals, which do not include shock collars, “helicoptering” a dog on a choke collar, alpha-rolling a dog (wolves don’t DO this!!!), or any other aversive techniques.

The approaches that we, and most of our colleagues, use are based on science, on a knowledge of animal behavior and psychology that has grown by leaps and bounds (little pun intended) in the past few decades.  We no longer use concepts like fixed action patterns, instinctive drift, and nature vs nurture; we know that punishment doesn’t work in dogs… our view of the animals with which we share this planet, and with which we associate every day, has become far more complicated, and far more fascinating.  I love my job!

We always love to hear from our readers, so feel free to let us know your thoughts on the KOMO piece. We know that this is an emotional topic for many people, so just a gentle reminder to be respectful when you post. You can also send email to Joel Moreno, KOMO-TV: jmoreno@komotv.com.

Comments

  1. Thank you Dr. Ha, thank you. The newest episode of the show featured wolf hybrids-and it brought me to tears! And yet, his fans will say you are jealous of him (I have seen posts to that effect, that all the experts are simply jealous -which is simply a ridiculous and rather silly statement to make). There is nothing to be jealous about the ability to mislead unknowing pet owners and abuse the very animals you are suppose to be helping. So thank you and keep speaking out-positive is the way.

  2. Dr. Ha, many colleagues of mine and I are so grateful that you have taken a public stand for the scientifically sound approaches to dog training. These methods of training are more humane and ethical than the methods Cesar Milan espouses.
    Unfortunately, many people will follow the examples of those they believe to be authority figures in that area of expertise without taking the time to learn more and make patient, well informed judgments. Cesar Milan is seen by many as an authority just for the fact that he has been given TV exposure through a very reputable source: National Geographic. Shame on you, National Geographic, for not taking the time to explore the field of dog training before misrepresenting the profession in such a big way.
    Thank you, Dr. Ha, for speaking out!!

  3. Dr. Ha, Thanks for speaking out and backing up your claims with legitimate science. You described it perfectly on KOMO when you said “Learned Helplessness” is what is happening to these dogs Milan “works” with.
    Furthermore, editing to get results is not dog training. As a legitimate dog trainer who has recently begun negotiating with a TV production company to develop a show about dogs, I can tell you that the “trainers” who sign these are selling out any say in what gets filmed in what sequence. In addition the clients on these shows are also silenced by a contract. That is why I have not finished the deal, I will not sell out.
    One thing legitimate dog trainers and behavioral experts realize is that behavior is not static, it’s contextual and dogs are not dominating us. The position statement on dominance by AVSAB recently released is yet another legitimate voice out here proclaiming the truth about how dogs learn. So even if one violently deals with a dog, their own or someone else’s as a trainer, and they squelch the behavior in that instant with something aversive, you created behavioral baggage that lingers. The severity of the aversive matters greatly, and yes one can have a humane consequence that is aversive and not damaging. Owners usually have enough in the bank with the dog by way of living with the dog and bonding, but dogs generalize fear well due their innate survival skills, so the dog may now be afraid of the next person/child who tries the same thing or something that appears like the aversive with the dog. Hence you get a fearful dog, and fear is related to aggression. The vast majority of dog owners do not want a fearful aggressive dog.
    What anyone should be asking themselves is why no respected scientific organizations back or support Milan? it is because they know how through actual legitimate science, how to best deal with our dogs and what the least stressful ways humans can and should conduct our actions with our dogs.
    All Milan is doing is perpetuating a falsehood that dogs are “dominant” or “stubborn” it is basically no more than what these charlatan Pet psychologists do. It is just that big money and Will Smith money at that is behind Milan’s animal abuse in the name of “training”.
    That “gift” which is touted by these pain trainers is actually abuse, period. As I say if you can’t explain it how can you train it?
    Recently I was speaking with a high ranking state SPCA investigator of animal abuse for the state of New Jersey it was in regards to a “trainer” who severely beat a dog in the name of training. He has been convicted and will be prosecuted. The SPCA investigator said something interesting, in a cruelty case where a trainer is involved the only question the judge and jury really need answered is “Was there any other training method that could have been used”? The answer is always YES!
    The days of abuse in the name of training are coming to a close, thanks for all your help in getting that goal accomplished!

    Drayton Michaels CTC http://www.pitbullguru.com

  4. I will add my R+ of praise and gratitude to the others who commented here. Thank you for being both brave and very clear about your stand and the scientific background for it. I hope the rising protests from this charismatic TV personality is a signal that his sway is losing strength.

    I am posting a link to this article from my website (www.wagntrain.com) and my training blog https://stacy-wagntrain.livejournal.com/ (which feeds into my Facebook page) – I’m hoping that together we can spread the word!

    Stacy Braslau-Schneck, MA CPDT CAP2

  5. Great Video. In Sacramento, we’re in the start up phase of creating a social enterprise animals rescue organization and hope to work with high risk kids in neighborhoods where many of our homeless pets come from. The important point is to teach empathy, especially in teaching kids to work with the bully breeds. The Milan method harms more than the dog, it harms the person. You have to objectify an animal and supress your bond with the animal by harming it with poor training techniques.

    Eileen Gillis
    Sacramento
    Packsrescue.com

  6. These comments have said it already but it must be said again – THANK YOU! If only we could educate more people about the horrible side effects of the rise of Millan! Every day I try to make people aware of the dangers but we need more articles like this to counteract his unfortunate popularity.

  7. Dear Dr. Ha,

    thank you so much for having the courage along with Mr Joel Moreno for speaking up. Although I have seen clips of Mr. Millan’s methods and have had first hand knowledge of how his techniques can harm a dog (via my clients coming to me for help), I thought the whole show exquisitely and unemotionally presented the facts while getting the point across. Even so, I cried watching those clips.

    thanks again for your courage to speak out against harmful techniques.

    Warm woofs,

    Nannette Morgan, BA CPDT
    Pawsitive Pals Dog Training

  8. Dear Dr. Ha,
    My profound thanks for your clarity on the televised news segment and in this blog. I’m very grateful to you for speaking out. Shame on National Geographic and, moreover, shame on the sponsors who put their money into such a program.
    Warmly,
    Darlene Arden, Certified Animal Behavior Consultant
    http://www.darlenearden.com

  9. Thank you to everyone who posted before me and to Dr Ha for being the guiding light and a hope to all the poor dogs suffering at the hands of thier well meaning but very uneducated owners.
    Cant they see thay no one wants to live with a bully? and if this kind of behaviour modification was used on humans we would lable it terrorism.
    One size DOES NOT FIT ALL so training methods have to be adjusted to the individual animals and of course breed needs.
    I have to actually remind clients that I cant “fix” a problem in 15mins like the TV would lead them to believe, and it takes time to reverse any harm dont by the 15 min Milan fix that they have watched and practiced on their own dogs without actually knowing anything about their own pets!
    Thank Dr Ha and
    UP THE REVOLUTION! 😉

  10. Dear Dr. Ha,

    Thank you so much. The more of us who are willing to speak out to educate the dog owners and dog lovers worldwide who have been taken in by Millan’s unscientific, harmful ways, the better. I’m delighted to say that this TV segment has gotten wide distribution across the Internet, and many trainers I know will be sharing it with clients who have drunk the Dog Whisperer Kool-Aid.

    A very heartfelt “Good for you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!”

    Pat Miller
    Peaceable Paws
    Fairplay, MD
    http://www.peaceablepaws.com

  11. Dear Dr. Ha,
    Another voice here in support of your appearance on KOMO TV with Joel Mareno. I train dogs and handlers for search and rescue, among other things, and after almost 40 years of dog training, I am dismayed by the popularity (celebrity) of Cesar Milan. I admit to using several of his methods in the past, but have evolved considerably, – I hope – and punishment based behavior control methods have been gone from my repertoire for at least 15 years. I continue to apologize for my past.

    An anecdote to illustrate: I had a private consult where a woman answered the door with stitches in her hand and one of her dogs had drains in his side. Not a good impression from the first moment, but I swallowed hard. It turns out that the owners were strict followers of the Dog Whisperer, but had ‘hit the wall’. I was expected to deal with the fallout without putting any blame on the owners, or confronting their belief system established by a celebrity with no legitimate credentials. It was quite a lesson in diplomacy, as well as dog training. We learn what we teach.

    Just TRY to train a reliable Search Dog with aversives and see what happens. Our SAR dogs just love to learn new things, and face each challenge with joy and enthusiasm, with no fear of corrections! They have no negative experiences around people – on purpose, anyway. 😉

    Thank you and all the people involved with this helpful news report. I only hope that no one ‘kills the messenger’.

    Regards,
    Charlotte
    SARTECH II
    President and training director
    WISARK9 Team
    http://www.wisark9.org/

  12. I watched Cesar’s show with the idea of learning about inate dog behavior but almost couldn’t do it as I watched incredulously at his methods of working with them! The agression is incredible.

    Do you have an opinion about Victoria on It’s Me Or The Dog? I’ve thought for a long time that she had creative ways of working with the dogs in a non agressive way as I watched her show recorded in England.

    I notice that since she has come to America she has incorporated the clicker in her work. She used it periodically in England but it wasn’t really used correctly. I notice she is using it more and more correctly and more often as time goes on in this new TV season.

    It’s made me wonder if she is working with anyone to learn the proper use of it or if she is doing her own private study and then applying it utilizing her own knowledge of dogs.

  13. Thank you so much for this. So many of my clients come to me convinced that Millan is practically God and that every approach to working with dogs is as valid as any other. I’m adding a link to this page to my anti-Millan, pro-science resources.

  14. Thank-you for having the guts to stand-up to the social pressure from Cesar Milan fans and the false positive press about him. His stuff is garbage, but because of WHO he knows (not WHAT he knows) he became a success. His methods are ancient and we have come so far in our knowledge about dog training- then he came along and set it all back.

    You do NOT have to hurt your pet to train it!!! Do you think you would be allowed to keep your child if anyone knew you used his methods on an out of control 3 yr old? Try explaining to child services why you had to choke the kid out to get it to behave. There are much more humane and effective methods to communicate to the dog (or child or other being) what you expect of him.

    So THANK-YOU again. I sure wish there were more people able to get enough press coverage to expose the truth! And dogs everywhere would be better off if Nat Geo took him off the air. People DON’T listen to their little disclaimer.

  15. I also applaud your efforts, Jim, to wave the Science-based Training Methods banner. It often feels like we’re in the nosebleed seats at the World Wide Dog Training Federation, but we at the Richmond (Virginia) SPCA are waving our Science-based Training Methods banners over here as well. Each day we receive multiple calls, e-mails and visits, daily through our Behavior Helpline services about pets in behavior peril. These pets are frequently in danger of losing their lives or at least their homes if there is no immediate solution to the existing reported problem – be it housetraining, destructive chewing, reacting to dogs on leash, or biting people. Many of the people who contact us still believe there should be some method of forcing “correct” behavior out of (or into) a pet.

    It appears fewer and fewer people look for basic training classes for their dogs, opting rather to “socialize” their dogs (through dog parks, day cares, pet stores and puppy classes) and address any unpleasant behaviors only after they have fully developed. Do these people avoid classes because they are afraid they will be asked to pin their puppy to the ground or otherwise manhandle their lovable mutt? Our task, as I see it, is to help people see the pleasure and rewards in actually training their dogs. Take the spotlight off of the dramatic, flashy, TV celebrity dog wranglers and place it on basic education and training. Of course, that’s like saying “Look away from the big top circus and pay attention to this lovely cello solo.” How do we, as science-based trainers, outshine the big top circus?

    We, at the Richmond SPCA, continue to attempt new efforts to bring effective training center stage. We teach basic skills and tricks to the dogs in our shelter so people can feel that sense of communication when they ask a dog something and he responds. We hold doggy fashion shows (with or without garment), so people can see how well-behaved pets can make a public appearance more enjoyable. We have a strong running program to encourage people to run and otherwise exercise with their pets. We even choreographed a half-time event at a soccer game showing off some basic dogs skills with some well-trained dogs and their people.

    Thanks so much for YOUR efforts to bring the benefits of science-based training methods more to light.

    Marie E. Tripton
    Senior Behavior & Training Specialist
    Richmond SPCA
    Richmond, VA

  16. Dr. Ha,

    from the bottom of my heart, thank you for what you did with the interview and with this article. Like you my staff and I have felt tremendous frustration at the popularity of Millan forceful techniques. More than a few dogs that we have worked with that did not have a history of aggression began displaying aggressive behaviors after our clients decided to give Millan’s techniques a try.
    What you have done here is a tremendous step in the right direction of educating the public about the truth of force training and the fallout that it creates.

  20. Thank you for taking the time to appear on KOMO. I enjoyed the piece and have hopes that it will open the eyes and minds of viewers.

    I am not a professional. I am just a pet owner with an interest in training and behavior and a desire to learn. Yet I see the fall-out from Mr. Millan’s popularity on a daily basis. It has gotten to the point where I am wary of meeting “dog people,” as long before I learn their first names I am made aware of their adoration for Cesar Millan. I have seen his fans alpha roll, choke and kick their dogs. His fans have told me (often violent) stories of the “dominant” things their dog did and how they “put them in their place” using Mr. Millan’s methods. One of his fans even grabbed my puppy by the throat and yelled in his face for play growling at the dog park. (We no longer visit dog parks–far too dangerous.) Dog rescues in my area have latched on to his methods, too. One rescue turned me away when I offered to volunteer with them because I said that I will not follow Mr. Millan’s methods.

    I am a former Millan fan (from before he was a household name). It was persons such as yourself, Mr. Ha, that took time out of their busy schedules to educate me. You may not realize how much you are helping dog owners and their dogs by speaking out. Please keep at it. We “dog people” can be slow to accept change, but I have faith that we will get there.

    Thank you and take care.

  21. Thank you dr. Ha, and especially Komo TV for speaking out the truth. I am a portuguese dog trainer and in Portugal and Brazil Cesar is the sensation of the moment. I run a blog where I write articles that talk about his techniques and how harmfull they are. It is good to know I am not alone in the journey to make people see the thruth behind Cesar Millan and the lack of knowledge he has.

    Keep up the great work.

    Cláudia Estanislau

  23. Hi there, While I respect the views of all, I feel that to refer to methods of using angry energy or “kicking” a dog is not Cesar’s Way at all in my experience. Also Cesar’s Way is not training. I often find that there is much written on both sides, when in fact dog psychology is not an exact science and dogs are not wolves!

    I have a pack of 14 dogs all rehabilitated through the inspriation of Cesar, these dogs would not be here alive today otherwise. I do not alpha roll a dog using physical force, I do not bribe them using treats, I gain their respect for me as their leader, they follow me willingly and abide by the rules within our very successful pack structure.

    As for techniques, there are many different ones used to meet the individual treatment needs, while desensitization can indeed work it take a long time – some dogs do not have the luxury of such an ammount of time, so flooding can work with individual dogs freeing them from fear and leading them back to balance.

    While some people do seem to try to copy Cesar and get it wrong, the same can be siad of many others and other methods, this does not in my opinion make what Cesar is doing wrong – he cannot control everyone! He is trying to edcuate owners in the benefits of pack leadership and I for one support this, people are always advised to get in professional help.

    The follow-ups on many of Cesar’s cases show dogs who have returned to balance, many “last chance” dogs, they are no longer acting-out risking their own lives. I for one believe the owners of the dogs, not just rumour or assumptions.

    As I say opinions will always vary, Science can tell us much but every dog is different – unique and if we are talking of contexts then surely this just backs-up that each dog in its own context is not necessarily going to comply with the science findings…research and findings are just that – based upon the dogs in the study, not all dogs!

    Cesar’s Way is not about harming dogs, where this comes from I do not know or understand, I cannot “positive” my way out of one of my dogs serious aggression, it just does not work! Correction – consequence and redirection does work – he is now rehabilitated.

    He only uses the tools in the DW the owner uses/wants to use. If other people follow without the professional help he clearly advises then that is surely their own responsibility and interpretation and no other person can take that problem on board – humans will be humans!

    My dogs are true success stories of Cesar’s philosophy!

    Now lives are being saved – why don’t we talk about this more?

  24. I have been involved in rescue and rehabilitation of dogs for over 11 years, I have placed dozens of dogs into good homes just in the last 3 years (most of which others refused to take on and foster), and have only had one come back to me (who, has since gone to another home with success). I am involved in advanced obedience and agility training at competition level, and I have lived with multiple dogs, big and small, all my life since I could walk (35 years and counting).

    Anyone that knows Cesar Millan and studies his techniques in detail understands there is *never* any “hitting”, man-handling, or any abuse of any kind, on or off the show. What he deals with in many cases are what he classifies as “red-zone” cases – dogs that are highly aggressive and are a danger to their owners, other people and other dogs. Dogs that are literally on their way out to a shelter or worse if Cesar can’t help them and their owners. Many of these are dogs that most trainers and behaviorists would most likely recommend be put to sleep. These are dogs that most trainers and behaviorists won’t touch.

    This is where Cesar comes in. He has helped literally *thousands* of people and pets to live peacefully together, by explaining why dogs react the way they do to nervous, insecure energy (or moods, if you will) given off by humans. To him, there are no “disposable dogs”, regardless of the breed, size or temperament. He understands what it is to match the energy and intensity of a dog in that state of mind, knowing that the wrong rehabilitation approach can actually *nurture* the aggression and other unwanted behaviors.

    In fact, in so many episodes I’ve seen him utilize MANY different positive-based approaches. If you follow the show, it’s not all about “alpha-rolls”, and when it is there is a very good reason for it (creating calm-submission in a dog that literally wants to kill something or someone). I’ve seen people brought to tears with gratitude that they didn’t have to give up on their dog(s), including those that have service dogs that they rely on to live as normal a life as possible. Cesar has touched so many people and has saved countless dogs’ lives throughout his career, and there are many more to come.

    I would also like to explain the difference between what is called a “touch” and what is considered “punishment” or “hitting”. Let’s start with clarifying “punishment” vs. “discipline” as well. An example of punishment would be angrily taking a dog and putting him in a crate after an unwanted behavior occurs. Or, rubbing a dog’s nose in feces after the dog has made a mistake on the carpet. Or, simply yelling at a dog. All of these are examples of punishment, and they don’t work. It’s all human psychology that many humans will try to apply to a dog. No one will ever see Cesar doing this, it doesn’t happen. An example of “discipline” would be addressing (blocking or redirecting) a dog’s behavior right before / at the moment / or within 1 second of the unwanted behavior occurring. My main point here is he applying dog psychology to correct unwanted behavior and reward good behavior, instead of applying human psychology which gives the opposite of the desired result.

    So, “touching” a dog vs. “hitting or kicking” a dog. Hitting and kicking are done out of, and with, anger and frustration on the part of the human. The dog *feels* this, it is not effective and it is cruel. Cesar does not “hit” dogs. No one ever should. But there is a huge difference between hitting / kicking and *touching* a dog to redirect his attention – to startle him out of whatever unhealthy state of mind he is in, to help bring back calm-submissive behavior. There is a very specific way(s) of doing this. There is nothing wrong with touching a dog, in fact, it is one of the natural ways in which animals communicate with each other.

    Another point I feel the need to raise, regarding “people have tried his techniques and failed, and made the dogs worse”. Throughout his show, probably, I would say every 30 seconds.. there is a HUGE banner that pops up on the screen that says (paraphrasing) “There are many ways to help your dog. DO NOT attempt these techniques without consulting a professional…” etc. I’ve heard of people that have also made dogs worse by tossing food at them while they are around level 10 aggression – but personally I won’t blame Victoria Stillwell for that. It’s not her fault and it’s not Cesar’s fault if people are attempting their advanced techniques on unbalanced dogs and not getting good results. It is the responsibility of the human to get proper training and advice before taking on the rehabilitation and/or training an unbalanced dog. It can (and should) take years to achieve this level of knowledge and skill.

    So I think the main message coming from Cesar is that best formula for a truly fulfilled and happy dog, in this order, is: 1) exercise 2) discipline (rules, boundaries and limitations) and 3) affection. Affection is a reward, and is essential to keeping a dog happy and fulfilled – but the problem is that so many dog owners only give affection, affection, affection – creating an unbalanced state of mind in a dog. When a dog is not balanced, that is part of what creates unwanted behavior and conditions (aggression, fear, anxiety, phobias, etc.).

    Finally, something I see a lot on training forums – the total lack of clarification between *training* and *rehabilitation* of dogs. While there is overlap, there is a huge difference. Cesar’s show is not about training, it is about rehabilitation. To be clear, the only ones being trained on his show are the humans. Sure, dog training is one part of the rehabilitation process, but Cesar’s techniques are not “training” techniques. They are to help unbalanced dogs move on, move forward, and achieve a balanced & peaceful way of being.

    Thanks for reading my post, and for providing a place to have an open, balanced discussion.
    Craig

  25. I believe there are many people who don’t understand Cesar Millan’s philosophy-those that are vehemently against him and those who are fans. I admit, many fans of his simply watch what he does and do it on their dogs. They don’t take the time to understand the philosophy behind it. If they did, they would realize that Cesar will use different actions with different dogs and different behaviors. Many of these fans will also punish their dogs for unwanted behavior. Cesar, on the other hand, corrects his dogs. Just as in human behavior, their is always an action and reaction. If a child steps out of line, they are corrected. If the parent does it out of anger, it becomes punishment. If the parent does it with the intent to teach the child what he/she did wrong, it is a correction. Same with dogs. I have watched dogs and have seen correct one another. Sometimes the correction is as slight as a look, a posture, maybe a slight growl because the action that warrants the correction was lower intensity. However, I also see dogs who use their muzzle to jab other dogs or grab a dog’s scruff with their mouth firmly but not aggressively. These corrections were done for actions that were higher intensity, more offensive. I have seen dogs who willingly will lay down and roll over, exposing their stomachs, when corrected. Often this is called an alpha roll. Note that the dog doing the correction is not FORCING the other down. It simply corrects the second dog, who then goes down to the ground. That dog submitting is not afraid of the other dog-most times after it submits, the correcting dog backs off because the correction is done and lesson learned, and they go back to playing, or exploring together, or sleeping next to each other, or whatever they were doing beforehand. It is not a fear tactic. It is a reaction to a correction.

    On a personal note, I have a fear aggressive dog. She will snap out of fear when dogs sniff her. However, since I have instituted Cesar’s philosophy into our own pack, she has improved. I correct her with a gentle but firm touch to her rump if she shows signs of aggression. This is meant to redirect her attention from the sniffing dog back to me, her pack leader. In regards to dog’s not needing a pack-how do you explain photos of hurricane katrina dogs who formed packs in the aftermath, all different breeds of dogs? How do you explain the distinct pack order amongst my pack with I had 3 dogs? I saw with my own eyes the dominant dog who got to go through the door first, drink from the water bowl first, walk through the house while the others moved out of his way, etc. It was done with no aggression what-so-ever (another part of Cesar’s philosophy). The other 2 dogs were not afraid of him, they simply deffered to him. However, ALL 3 dogs deferred to me because they knew I was their pack leader.

    I have respectful dogs. They don’t jump on me when I come home not because I taught them to stay on all fours, but because I taught them they are not allowed to DEMAND attention from me or enter my personal space with excited energy. They are certainly happy when I come home, but will wait for me to say hi to them. They don’t bolt out of the door when I open not because I taught them to sit and stay in one spot, but because I taught them they look to me for direction. Just because the door is open does not mean they get to go outside. They don’t fight over their food or bark constantly for me to feed them because I taught them that all resources are mine first as their pack leader so they will wait patiently for me to share with them. I didnt’ have to teach them to lay down and stay when I’m busy or don’t want to pet them. Instead of demanding attention by barking or nudging against me constantly, they come up to me and sit at my feet, waiting for me to reward their calm submissive energy. Just as a child should not be allowed to interupt their parents when they are talking, so my dogs are taught they do not have the right to DEMAND me of anything. Just as children are given rules, boundaries, and limitations based on child psychology, so my dogs are given the same based on dog psychology.

  26. I’m pleased to see that there are other Cesar advocates here. I find it very disheartening to see Cesar, a man who saves countless lives, being taken all wrong by Dr. Ha and those that just don’t “get” him and his philosophy. I’ve worked with my dog via positive only classes, as well as studying and using Cesar Millan’s philosophy. And to be quite honest, I’ve gotten much better results with Cesar’s Way. Now, I’m an advocate of the luring and so-called “positive” methods, as well. But they are not the only way and don’t work with all dogs. Actually, I feel that the positive methods work better when incorporating Cesar’s Way as a foundation – establishing yourself as a pack-leader. Once I did this, and more fully understood what that meant, things have been falling more into place. Not to say my dog is perfect, but we’ve eliminated most of her issues and the others are not nearly as bad. We’re working on them.

    No, Cesar does not harm the dogs. If people are attempting his methods but doing harm to their dog, then it’s not Cesar’s Way. He has no control over what others do. Alpha rolls DO occur in nature, but are only applied in circumstances when a dog is intending to attack. Packs DO occur in nature, as someone else mentioned above, that was shown by victimized dogs in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina.

    Dr. Ha, if you want to see a trainer who DOES physically abuse dogs, then you might want to check out Ewe-topia down in Roy. I’m not sure if he would outright tell you what he does unless you sign up with him for a session. I will not take my dog there again. He claims to be a Cesar proponent, but what he does is NOT like what Cesar does. I saw one of his own dogs literally shivering in his presence when brought out of his cage, which just turned my stomach. You wouldn’t find that with Cesar at all. The dogs respect Cesar, they aren’t afraid of him.

    Please, Dr. Ha and other “professionals”, lay off of Cesar. I never hear him talking bad about other dog professionals and I find it very unprofessional to hear others speak badly of him. If you watch his program often, read his books, and really study what he does and what he says, you might have a better understanding.

  27. Hey there, CM advocates, did you actually watch the two clips that were on the news piece? In my humble opinion, they were horrific. The dogs were panicked out of their minds, crazed beyond belief. Once, long ago, I subscribed to the Kohler method–yeah–complete with helicoptering (which I never did, thankfully). To this day, I still thank my (now long dead) dog for forgiving me for all I did to him, and what I did was extremely mild compared to those CM clips. Maybe CM is working with “red-zone” dogs, giving them that last chance, but people, there has GOT to be a better way than “Cesar’s Way”. Would you advocate using his methods on, say, prison inmates? How about on violent, mentally impaired children? Ever heard of “A Clockwork Orange”? Do the ends really justify the means? Think!

  28. I own and operate a licensed, Insured Rescue shelter home that gets in mainly last chance dogs. 95% of which come from high kill shelters, and have no time left.

    As they come in with unknown history, chances are they have behavioral baggage. Many fearful, left in the field as they are a strong hunting breed, and many abused with harsh methods…forced retrieves…and some beaten for not performing the way their humans felt they should.

    These dogs have made tremendous progress using Cesar directed methodology. People criticizing seem to have not studied, watched the dvds, nor read his books. I have opened my mind to many methods through the years, and do use a combination when rehabilitating an animal.

    I see Cesar’s philosophy as a guide for dog owners to provide a secure leadership role for the dog so they can enhance their relationship with their canine companion.
    We have had a few dogs come into our rescue with ten page “behavioral” reports that have the clients rewarding aggressive behavior? Reinforcing bad behaviors leading to escalating problems.

    I have a rescue here right now that has done a near 180 degree change in behavior since we have used NILIF and Cesar’s way in just three weeks.
    We have used direction, energy, and migration walks daily. We also go to an huge indoor facility to exercise, and implement games that are challenging for her. She is bonding so well to the family, and loves to go for her play sessions.

    Cesar encourages daily outdoor play and interaction with our dogs. and we enjoy being with them on walks and adventures. Outings were something we did maybe once a week on the weekends before Cesar…Now it is a daily routine, and we are all much happier because of it.

    Suzy came in with high value possession aggression, food aggression (both directed at humans and other dogs), and out right dog aggression. We have two issues down, and will start migration walks with my calm balanced dogs with Suzy wearing a soft muzzle as the dog aggression seems to be her only behavior we will need to address now.

    We have rehabilitated over 200 dogs now that were last chance dogs. We have hand 3 dogs returned out of the 200 simply because they did not provide Pack Leadership. What is odd, is that after all these years working with and listening to some of the top breeders in the Nation of Wirehaired Pointers, even before Cesar Millan came along, they ALL agreed on one thing, and that was strong Leadership! PACK Leadership.

    Cesar is very supportive of any method that does not harm the dog. And so am I.

  29. To Dr. Ha: You say you actually WATCHED the episode with the two wolf hybrids? If you did, you certainly saw a different show than I saw! One of the wolves fought the leash fiercely… Cesar held him away from his own body so the wolf couldn’t attack him, but he didn’t “strangle him” or hurt him in any way. Did you see where he corrected the owner of another dog on the same show about touching the dog too hard with her foot? SHE was knocking her dog off balance; Cesar was merely distracting him from whatever he was focused on.

    Cesar has long said that any method that doesn’t hurt the dog is good. His methods, which range from leash corrections to positive reinforcement, are not the point of his show or his philosophy. His point is that calm, assertive owners lead to calm, submissive dogs. Or, if you prefer, relaxed, obedient dogs. Same thing, different words.

    Cesar has taken his philosophy into a women’s prison (see episode “Dogs on Parole”) and has taught the women how to be calm and assertive without being aggressive. One cannot be calm and be aggressive at the same time, after all. Cesar doesn’t TRAIN dogs. He rehabilitates them. And he coaches their owners in his calm, assertive philosophy so they can continue to have a calm, obedient dog.

    Those who dislike Cesar on the basis of one TV show (which they didn’t watch with an open mind, but watched with their prejudices at full alert) will never be convinced that they themselves use a lot of Cesar’s philosophy. Most trainers know that when humans get excited, dogs get excited, and in many situations, excited dogs won’t obey.

    Those who dislike Cesar on the basis of what other people have said about him are just the recipient of scurrilous rumors spread by those who don’t know what they’re talking about.

    It is absolutely insulting for anyone to think for even one instant that those of us who are Cesar fans are deliberately cruel to our dogs, that we don’t love our dogs as much as the Cesar haters do, or that we condone or tolerate harsh methods when gentler ones will do the job.

  30. Those two clips on KOMO-TV were so phony! I saw the episodes they were referring to, and they showed the dogs when Cesar first started working with them, when the dogs were still fighting for supremacy. Cesar simply wouldn’t give it to them. that kind of totally biased reporting is one of the reasons so many alleged trainers decry Cesar’s philosophy. “Exercise, Discipline (which means rules, boundaries, and limitations), and Affection” is Cesar’s Fulfillment Formula. It is for dogs as it is for children. When a child has been spoiled rotten all his life, it takes some strong corrections (not punishments) to make him civilized again. And it’s not the child’s fault (or the dog’s fault) when the parents (or owners) don’t teach the child (or the dog) how to behave themselves. But they (the child or the dog) are the ones who pay the price for the adults’ ignorance and laziness. If you believe what you saw in those two clips, you’re probably not salvageable, but we can always try… staying calm and assertive, of course. Cesar isn’t a trainer. He has said repeatedly that he isn’t a trainer. He’s a dog psychologist. He’s had more experience interacting with dogs than 99% of the degreed behaviorists who follow theory instead of years of practice. Cesar grew up on a farm with a large pack of dogs. He saw – and he knows – how they interact with each other, and what it takes to earn a dog’s respect and trust.

    It’s strange that the alleged trainers criticize and berate Cesar and all his fans. Cesar never says a negative word against them. Guess he’s a little more calm and assertive than they are

  31. Thank you for supporting Cesar and his ways with training. I wonder under the circumstances, in regards to the pets he has brought about, if anyone else with nowledgeable training of dogs would have succeded like he has done so many times over? I have read all of Cesar’s books and watched everyone of his programs and have not found his way of training to be anything but favourable. We have had dogs for many years now and believe me… in the areas that they have needed improvement it certainly has worked for us….and they all have survived his training methods and still love us as much as we love them……there are always those who love to bad-mouth the successful……….why, I do not know. Logically if you do not agree with his way then do the training another way but for heavens sake stop condeming him for what he believes and has faith in along with many other dog owners, as well as myself. My husband and I support Cesar and his training methods all the way. I feel that “tough love” is not only for humans but for our pets as well.

    PS: We have the most affectionate dogs as you would ever want to meet……..

  32. I am posting a small snippet from an article written by Tammie Rogers of DarnFar Ranch with her permission.

    “I don’t want to speak for Cesar, so I won’t refer to “Cesar’s method”. I don’t want to speak for the lady on “It’s me or the dog”, especially since her methods are not “ALL positive” or “only click-treat”, but she certainly has a prevailing strategy that falls into the “new age” methodologies. So, I will refer to the two methods as “correction for compliance” or “incentive + ignore”. I know that neither titles are perfect for describing the methods, but I needed to separate them the best that I could.

    The two basic premises of the “Incentive + Ignore” method are “offer incentives” for desired behaviors and “ignore bad behavior” and it will go away. The folks who use these methods use “scientific research” to make you think that they have some new-found data to support their dog training strategies. I will simply say that most of those folks are not scientist themselves, and their ability to interpret data is, at times, a bit off kilter, in my opinion. I say that as a scientist, myself; a person who has a degree in science and worked in the field (designing and statistically interpreting experiments in a highly reviewed field) for over twenty years. But, I also speak as a dog expert who does not rely on science to train dogs because training dogs is more an art as it is a science. The “new age” folks will criticize Cesar because he isn’t a scientist and doesn’t have a degree. I’m here to say, as a scientist, that you don’t need a degree to train dogs. You need skills (both innate and learned through experience). Some people are just good at training dogs in the same way that some people are just very good at playing the piano. There is an innate aptitude that enhances learned skills that are acquired through experience. Cesar obviously has an innate ability, which could also be called a gift.”

    I feel there is lots to learn from many, many people. I do not put down anyone unless they are doing harm to a dog or any animal for that matter. Cesar Millan does not harm dogs. He is very good at what he does. He also explains things in a very clear way. I can’t agree with people alpha rolling their dogs when they do not have the expertise to know what they are doing.

    Cesar does help many people to attain a very intimate bond with their dogs.

    Respectfully,

    Carol Shows

  33. Cesar Millan (and other dog behaviorists such as Dr Patricia McConnell and Victoria Stillwell) practices PACK LEADERSHIP. McConnell says “be a benevolent pack leader”. This is absolutely no different from what Millan does. I take great offense at so-called professional people attacking Millan and his great gift he has with understanding dogs. It’s too bad you all can’t take a page from his book and take the high road. Why lower yourself to mud slinging? There is plenty of room in the world for everyone. Have you seen our new President this week? You may have noticed, on his first day in office, he lightly touched Vice President Biden’s arm when Biden was cracking jokes during the swearing in ceremony for White House Staff. The first thing I thought of was Cesar Millan, who touches dogs in the exact same way — just a light touch to redirect their behavior. If you would take the time to REALLY WATCH Dog Whisperer episodes, instead of taking snippets of what you perceive as abuse and commenting only on those, you would eat your words like a canine eating a dog biscuit. Cesar’s methods are not a re-hash of “old school” — your grandfather’s methods from 1950 — it is simply a gift he has for being in tune with the dogs. I am sad for you that you must be so competitive and unpleasant towards something that clearly works so well. And, btw, no, most people should NOT try Cesar’s Way themselves with aggressive dogs… they do not have the inborn gift and skill that Cesar has. And most certified dog trainers probably don’t, either. Please try to take the high road in life instead of this unpleasantness. The universe will reward you.

  34. What I find most unfortunate is that while the success of CM’s program demonstrates that the public really wants to know more about dog behavior and how to interact with dogs, National Geographic has chosen instead to give them unscientific and potentially dangerous information. How far the organization has fallen from the days of The Magazine That Could Not Be Thrown Away. Very disappointing.

  35. A hearty Congratulations and THANK YOU to Dr. Ha and to KOMO for airing the piece.

    Notes on remarks made by other posters:
    Kathy M suggests that Mr. Millan is a ‘behaviorist such as Dr. Patricia McConnell’. FACT: A ‘behaviorist’ is a VERY specific term, and requires VERY specific training and educational degrees in order to be able to USE the distinction. Mr. Millan has no such degree and/or training, by his own admission and his own biography. According to Millan himself, he has not attended any college, much less graduated high school. He has no formal training in working with dogs other than apprenticing as a groomer’s helper. While to his credit, I have never heard Mr. Millan use this term to describe himself, I am astounded at the number of people who DO use it on a regular basis.

    Kaelinda suggests that Millan is ‘a dog psychologist. He’s had more experience interacting with dogs than 99% of the degreed behaviorists who follow theory instead of years of practice.’ I beg to differ. Again, ‘psychologist’ is a term that suggest further education and credentialing – neither of which Millan has. As well, if you have worked under or with any Veterinary Behaviorist, you would know that they have years of experience working with dogs hands-on, so I am assuming that you’ve never worked with a Veterinary Behaviorist such as Dr. Karen Overall or Dr. Sophia Yin, or Dr. Nicholas Dodman… but we can also point to an Ethologist/Zoologist such as Dr. McConnell, who has had a working farm for years, with multiple dogs, or Dr. Raymond Coppinger, who not only worked with village dogs all over the world but also had a competitive mushing team for years on the east coast. Again, Mr. Millan is very careful not to refer to himself as a ‘psychologist’, but has been known to say he’s LIKE a ‘dog psychologist’.

    Either way, he’s missing some pretty important education and credentials. So, let me ask you both: if you, or your child were ill and needed cognitive behavioral therapy or counseling, would YOU hand over YOUR hard-earned dollars to someone without credentials? Someone who hadn’t graduated high school? Someone who ‘apprenticed’ with someone else in a different field than the one they advertise their services under? Probably not… but, I could be wrong, I’m sure.

    To comment on the video clips: I made myself watch the WHOLE episode with the Jindo twice.

    I happen to have some training in medical issues. I watched the episode twice, first with the sound, and the second time without the sound (that old bugaboo research has shown that when a person is looking right at something, if someone else is giving a ‘voice over’ or explanation, it really doesn’t matter what they are seeing — they will remember what they HEARD most of the time).

    During the first viewing, I heard Mr. Millan talk about the need to bring the Jindo into a ‘calm, submissive state’ during and at the end of the segment where he used a choke collar to help him do so (he did pronounce himself successful in this endeavor).

    During the second viewing, my physiology education kicked in. What I SAW was the physical evidence of strangulation and having ones air supply cut off. First, struggling for air, gasping, trying to escape. Next, a stiffening of the body as the tissues are being robbed of oxygen (you notice the dog’s legs stop bending, either at knees and later at hips). Then we see the animal fall over stiff-legged on it’s side — another manifestation of severe oxygen deprivation. Finally, the dog’s tongue, swollen and dry, is seen hanging out of his mouth (but only for a very short time before the camera switches back to Mr Millan, who is explaining that the dog is now in a ‘calm submissive state and ready to learn’).

    What I saw, without voice overs, was that he nearly killed a dog by cutting off it’s oxygen supply on national television. I was appalled that the owners did not bring abuse charges against him — I would have expected the wife to, at the very least. I was even MORE appalled that the ASPCA or even the HSUS didn’t bring charges, either.

    Abuse CAN be quantified, and I see it on that show. When I watch it, I feel like I’m living in some alternate world where public floggings are still acceptable and attended by throngs of spectators. It makes me physically ill to see any living creature harmed for the sake of television ratings.

    I work with difficult and severely aggressive dogs on a regular basis. Aggression begets aggression — what you put out for the dog is exactly what you are going to get back — physics, plain and simple, cause and effect.

  36. Thank you, Dr. Ha, for your calm, clear, accurate explanations of the very real concerns about Mr. Millan’s actions.

    The editing in the KOMO piece did a good job of showing what savvy dog-lovers see — regardless of the gentle, friendly-sounding explanation and the build-up, Mr. Millan often ends up doing something that is hurtful, unnecessary, and unlikely to change the dog’s behavior for the better.

    For his supporters, I celebrate your desire to do right by your dogs. But, like any celebrity or corporation, Mr. Millan and NGC may not be doing right by you.

    It is my care for the general public and their dogs that prompts my support of attempts to educate people about the issues with Mr. Millan’s techniques. The people posting here to support Dr. Ha are not your enemy — we just want you to understand so you and your dogs can be protected from the things that can go wrong with this sort of dog handling.

    One very important idea that Mr. Millan seems not to know is that, despite the fact that the “dominance/pack/alpha” stuff got ubiquitous for a while, it has absolutely no basis in fact. There is no way to know exactly what a non-verbal animal is thinking, and there is no proof that dogs recognize a Leader or need a strict heirarchy.

    If you really do the research on this, you’ll see that it’s true — the idea may seem to be “everywhere” (although it really isn’t), but everything you’ll find in favor of it is opinion; links referring back to someone else’s opinion, or a bit of long-since refuted research from many decades ago.

    Understanding who is Boss, and obeying that Boss, is, in fact, a very human idea. So, it is Mr. Millan who is anthropomorphizing, treating dogs like little people in fur.

    I know that may come as a shock. But, regardless of whether someone is dressing a dog up in frou-frou outfits, imagining that Lassie really understands the full, complex directions for finding someone to save Timmy, or claiming that dogs will know you are The Boss if you exude calm energy, all of these involve pretending that dogs think like people.

    There is simply no evidence that it is true.

    Semantic changes, like saying it is “rehabilitation” or “psychology,” doesn’t change the fact that what Mr. Millan is doing is an attempt to change dogs’ behaviors, just like any trainer. So, whether he wants to be called a trainer or not, he is claiming to be one.

    And, since nobody can read a dog’s mind and dogs can’t talk, there is no such thing as dog psychology. That’s why a behavioral approach is so effective – it doesn’t get muddied up with wrong guesses about what a dog is thinking.

    The techniques Mr. Millan uses are like trying to do embroidery with a hammer — they are just the wrong tools for the job.

    Reward-based traning is not wifty, babying-the-dog stuff. It is using dogs’ own desires and needs to get them to willingly learn new behaviors, give up unwanted ones, get past their fears and defensiveness, and happily obey.

    It gets especially frustrating, sometimes, when the behavioral approach gets dismissed as New-age crunchy-granola, when it is so down-to-earth, accurate, and based in reality.

    Mr. Millan’s approach is the one that is coming from a magical-thinking point of view.

  37. Thank you Dr. Ha and others for explaining so eloquently why some of Cesar Milan’s methods are counter productive and sometimes inhumane. As an uninformed viewer, with limited knowledge of the science behind dog behavior, I was initially impressed with Cesar’s methods. The clips of his show sure looked like the animals were being changed, right before my eyes. Also, his simple philosophy made perfect sense to me. In some ways it still does – being calm when working with your dog will facilitate a better reaction and relationship than when you get worked up or anxious about aggressive or annoying behavior (on the dog’s part.) 😉

    I also am in complete agreement that most dogs do not get enough exercise. We want them to be available to us when we care for interaction, and then “good” behavior when we are too busy to be bothered. I say this from experience. I am a serial dog owner, who has never had a successful relationship with my dogs, as I did not spend the time to commit to exercising and training them.

    I have learned a lot from positive training groups on Yahoo! Groups, as well as reading a number of books on animal behavior such as Karen Pryor’s “Don’t Shoot the Dog”, Patricia McConnell’s “The Other End of the Leash” and “Culture Clash” by Jean Donaldson, to name a few.

    One of the things that really concerns me about Mr. Milan’s show is that all we see are the edited clips and also, we don’t know how things are going a year later. It is a huge unknown.

    The science of animal behavior training methods is vast and documented. Positive methods work and the effects are long lasting and build a fabulous relationship with your dog.

    I am now happy to report that I have finally made the commitment needed to properly care for a dog. We spend over two hours a day together, walking, running, training and just snuggling. Oh, and she did have some minor aggressive behaviors when I adopted her, but working with the positive methods I learned, I am happy to report that she is doing very well, and no longer exhibits most of the behaviors (after one month of positive methods.)

    Patty Smith

  38. Thank you so much Dr Ha, I am from Hong Kong, Cesar Millan is not a huge star in HK yet, but I have seen lots off people are using these technique in HK and unfortunately there were some word spreading around of Cesar Millan last year, some people are seeing him as a real dog trainer, while the one using positive reinforcement are just sucks…. I am glad you have speak up in a scientific way!!!

    I am going to post your interview onto my web and wish I could change some of their minds.

    Thank you once again!!!

  39. FINALLY ppl are taking notice.
    I have said this since Milan aired his first show, of course no-one would listen.

    While some of his methods are common sense, most of them are pure bullying.

    There is a fine line between what Milan does and what postive reinforcement does.

    Trainers need to find a middle ground.

    PR does not work with all dogs, thats when you need to step it up a notch, be it a prong collar, a martingale, or a halti and a degree of physical correction.

    There are grey areas with both methods.

  40. Its nice that people are starting to see the truth. From the first time I watched his show I knew that this was NOT good training practices. I tried to tell people but everyone was so blindsided by him that they all laughed at me. The fear training that he does is nothing that I would ever consider doing to a dog. And the majority of the other training methods that they portray has being something of his own design are actually techniques we dog trainers have been using for years!

    A little info on me. I am a dog trainer and dog training consultant. As well as a Judge for a major dog registry in the USA.

  41. The biggest problem for me here is that so many of you who disagree with Cesar’s methods continue to refer to “the clips”! How can you possibly get all of your information from a 2 minute clip?

    First let me just ask….where did the first dog trainersbehaviorists come from? They had no school or certification. They trained others, and so on and so on. There is no certification required for anyone to become a dog trainer or behaviorist. I know quite a few people who are quite successful at rehabilitating dogs that would otherwise be euthanized and none of them have any specialized training. Cesar Millan learned from the best teachers about how to relate with dogs….the dogs themselves.
    The dogs he rehabs most of the time are because the owners have tried other’s techniques without success. Many times other trainers have recommended the dog be euthanized!! Is this a better choice? Not for me it isn’t. I’m all for rehabbing, not killing!

    If you do any sort of follow ups you will find comments that the owners themselves have made about the progress they have made since Cesar helped them better understand exercise, discipline and then affection and pack leadership. They’re not getting paid for this. I know of one individual who personally said to me that Cesar was so gentle with her dog.

    I think those of you who believe that Cesar is a bully need to set your DVR’s and actually watch the shows. He is a far more peaceful man than any of us. He is not call himself a trainer and he definitely does not use fear.

    Peace…

  42. To Gill Hamilton: I specialize in working with hard to train and so-called aggressive breeds. Punishment and physical corrections will only beget more aggression — cause and effect.

    To Jill V: You are correct, currently anyone can hang out a shingle and call themselves a ‘dog trainer’ — and thanks to television, there has been a HUGE number of people doing just that recently. However, you are incorrect that one can do the same thing and call them selves a ‘behaviorist’ — there are minimum educational requirements that must be met before one can LEGALLY use that term… heck, I can go around calling myself a doctor and start seeing patients, but you can be darned sure that I’d get arrested for it!

    As well, if you read the posts carefully, you will find that nearly ALL of the folks who posted — myself included — not only watched the clips, but have been watching entire episodes of this heavily edited television program. In many episodes, what is seen is clear and simple: fear, flooding, and abuse.

    Please take some time to educate yourself on canine communication, then watch his show without the sound on. Here’s a great cheat sheet from the Dog Scouts of America:

    https://www.dogscouts1.com/uploads/Dog_Body_Language_101.pdf

  43. One thing that I notice over and over again is that the majority of Cesar’s proponents tend to be laypeople, pet owners, or hobby trainers. I don’t see a lot of certified trainers, behaviorists, or others educated in the field who agree with and espouse his methods – whether or not they find said methods inhumane. Not only that, but I have yet to find a professional in the field who thinks that Cesar is a good judge of dog body language.

    To see a layperson refer to certified trainers and behaviorists as “professionals” – complete with quotes and sarcasm is, frankly, insulting. I wonder if the same people would dismiss their “doctors”, “lawyers”, “accountants” or other professionals with the same condescending tone?

    Thank you, Dr. Ha, for your article – it is a huge help to those of us who ARE professional dog trainers and behaviorists, and have to educate pet owners daily on why “Cesar’s Way” isn’t the best way.

    Having seen many episodes of the show myself (most horrifying to me, the episode mentioned here by a Cesar fan in which he works with a women’s prison and forces a terrified dog to the ground to have its nails trimmed) – I can only wonder how so many have convinced themselves that Cesar knows what he’s doing. Are we watching the same show? Clearly laypeople who aren’t familiar with dog body language are mistaking “paralyzed with fear” for “calm and submissive”. It’s a shame, and dogs deserve better.

    Jo, thanks for posting that great guide to canine body language. I hope those here who have lauded Cesar will take the time to educate themselves and review their stance.

  44. The Response to My Cesar Millan Blog

    I want to thank everyone who wrote in to provide support, and so many wonderful examples, in response my KOMO-TV spot and my follow-up blog entry. The response has been most impressive. I, of course, knew that there were many science-based trainers out there, trainers who have never bought into Cesar’s Way or who have switched to more effective methods when they learned of them. But so many of them read my blog and were willing to share their support!! I have passed along your comments to Joel Moreno, the KOMO-TV reporter that pushed along this piece and helped to get it on the air. He also was somewhat taken aback by the outpouring of information and emotion that the piece triggered, at first by upset CM fans, and later from a wave of appreciative trainers and owners.

    We have, of course, heard from the CM followers, and as long as their contributions were thoughtful and respectful, we have posted their comments as well. And the vast number of them (all but one, I think) were just so, and have been posted. Unfortunately, there is common among these responses the usual defenses.

    There have been the outright errors (“CM never kicks a dog”: this has been televised… how can you say that?? or “what he does is no different than what wild dogs or wolves do to each other”: wild dogs and wolves never alpha-roll each other, or choke each other hanging in the air, or shock each other, or force each other into fearful or exhausting situations!).

    There have been the caveats (“he only works with dogs that destined for euthanasia”: blatantly not true in his television show, his books, nor his LA-based practice).

    There have been the over-generalizations (“only his methods can rescue an aggressive dog destined for euthanasia”: obviously not true, as evidenced by the numerous practices of certified animal behaviorists and board-certified veterinary behaviorists, where we rescue such dogs regularly, and never using CM tactics).

    And of course, the big one: dogs misbehave because they lack leadership. The trouble with this one is that there are too many subtleties: wolves do fine without leadership in many ecological situations, many breeds of dogs don’t recognize social signals of other dogs and no longer possess social structures, and many breeds of dogs that do possess social structures don’t incorporate primates (us!) into that social structure. So along with the fact that wolves and wild dogs don’t alpha-roll, choke, or shock each other in social situations, many breeds of dogs don’t consider us part of their “leadership”, and can’t be forced to do so.

    Some breeds do incorporate us into their social structure, and social structure can be a problem issue in these breeds, when they are not properly socialized or reach certain ages when they challenge for leadership, but even then, they don’t EVER try to alpha-roll, choke, or shock us! These are not how dogs express social position, period. So the whole leadership thing, as an across-the-board, general training process, is simply wrong. Again, look at the science!

    But more important than all of this in my mind is the fact that these fans ignore the consequences of his approach. I have never said that his approach doesn’t work: fear-based methods do indeed cause a decrease in many behaviors. My concern is for the additional consequences of his approach: the development of learned helplessness leading to severe anxiety disorders, the establishment (substitution?) of fear aggression, and the danger of redirected aggression in these dogs. The symptoms of these potentially severe consequences (severe enough to require euthanasia) are even visible on his televised episodes, and are frequently reported by owners following these types of training experiences (I know; I have them as clients).

    In addition, we have the science of animal behavior research to support these observations. CM followers (not necessarily CM, who takes an “I’m not responsible for what my followers do with my methods” approach) routinely use these techniques with dogs for which these techniques are clearly inappropriate. I would happily suggest that dogs differ widely in their response to punishment: some will not be fazed at all, and others will develop serious disorders. Some will redirect their aggression, some will not. Punishment is a powerful tool to place into the hands of unsophisticated users, and the consequences of mistakes can be dangerous.

    On the other hand, positive learning techniques, which are the more modern, and science-supported, approaches to behavior modification in dogs (and many other species, including humans) are known to be more effective AND are less likely to have dangerous consequences in the hands of inexperienced handlers. It’s not that the punishment techniques of CM don’t work (at least in some dogs); it’s that the collateral damage is severe. Positive techniques work (ok, let’s say) as well or better, and are MUCH less likely to produce negative consequences. Why take the chance of potentially dangerous consequences when you can use alternative approaches and negate those consequences. THAT’s my issue with Cesar Millan’s techniques.

  45. Jim!!!!!!

    Long time no see/hear!!! Amazing to see you in the interview as posted by Grisha on the APDT website. I had no idea you’d gotten involved with dogs. I am a dog trainer myself now and agreed with every word you wrote in your blog! So nice to have a scientist weighing in from an academic institute and perspective. Let’s catch up.
    Rachel
    Positively Obedient
    Reisterstown, MD

  46. I’m an Australian veterinary nurse with over 17 years experience, developing in that time special interests in both environmental enrichment and body language. I watch all the animal related shows, CM’s DW, Animal Cops, Dogtown, It’s Me or the dog etc etc. Caesars show I watch purely so when my clients contact me about the show they watched, I can deal with the consequences.
    The early shows I was always truely horrified by his methods and quite obvious (to me – not to the lay person) lack of understanding of canine body language (ie: the “calm submissive” panting dog that in actual fact is completly stressed), especially as he was always proclaiming how much he loves dogs. I don’t doubt, and I don’t doubt his many proponants also truely love their dogs, after all they put up with so much from their dogs to keep them in their lives! Much of what Caesar spouts is just plain common sense. At no time has anybody suggested that CM or his fans didn’t love their pets – in fact that was even emphasied in the original news clip. My partner does not get my dislike of CM methods as all he sees is the “remarkable and immediate results” but my partner is not really a dog person, he is an everyday pet owner, which is primarily CMDW’s audience.
    For those that say CM takes on those that no one else can help, well DOGTOWN appears to manage these “red zone” dogs quite nicely without having to use adversive methods; gentle patience, understanding, kindness and rewards works wonders.

    To the people who keep saying “how can the detractors really make a descion based on those short clips” I did see the whole episodes of both clips….I ask you A) do you really think the use of an electronic shock collar is not cruelty, would YOU like to be the wearer – doubtful? if you really have to use an adversive collar, why not use the ones that emits citronella or water – not something that causes pain….it’s pain no matter how much the advocates try to say it doesn’t hurt.
    as for Jinda – did you not see the dog was absolutly gasping for breath and had a blue tongue at the end of the helicopter session? I suppose you could argue it has a naturally blue tongue as some dogs do – but in my professional opinion, it was blue because it had quite nearly chocked to death.

    CMDW’s very early shows where very dangerous and should never have been shown and as for that ridiculous disclaimer “don’t try this at home without professional help” I would suggest CM himself got a shock when a young girl came to him from the Make A Wish Foundation stating she had watched his shows and tried his methods (you see I really do actually watch his shows). I would argue that HE IS INDEED RESPONSIBLE FOR WHAT HIS FANS DO despite the disclaimer.

    As for those fans that say he doesn’t use punishment, then just what is an electronic shock collar? The writer that said he simply uses the tools the owner provides or wants, I agree, I have seen his body kanguage and the obvious distaste he displays over the prong collars. He should have the courage of his convictions and move them to alternative tools (he does now seem to be doing that now, albiet his own collar of course) – he quite obviously has the influence and as you all keep stating he is training the owners and rehabilitating the dog after all – don’t we want what is best for the dog.

    Yes I agree and also always said that unfortuantly as much as I like reward training, we would experience problems because of poor timing and inadvertant rewarding for inappropriate behaviour, as has been stated we are not all natural dog trainers. Example: We have two rottweilers and despite my best efforts my partner finds it difficult to follow my direction on inadvertent rewarding behaviour he doesn’t want – it’s human nature to want to nurture, protect, placate and reassure. Making it very difficult to ask the client to please stop trying to reassure their much loved precious pooch, telling Fido the nasty vet is only trying to help, inadvertently rewarding it for growling, snapping and biting at us.

    I have been pleased to see that CM does appear to be changing some of his techniques or at the least is not showing his more adversive “rehabilitations” on the show anymore. The most recent show I watched, he went to another trainer to help owners of a so called aggressive Shepherd. The trainer he went too used reward based training and as that trainer stated it doesn’t just have to be food (which is NOT bribary by the way – it’s pay…..would you work all week without pay or sorry, is that bribary?), it was what ever motivated the dog, toys, lures, balls. And what is better CM recognised the body language of another dog within the family, that in actucality was the real problem of the Shepherds aggression (which the owners still did not recognise at the end of the programm despite CM stating it a number of times – told you I watched the progams!). In that particular show you could see that Caesar was learning from this dog trainer too.
    I am still wary of and do not advocate his methods but it would appear, on the program at least, that he is evolving – just like we all have and will continue to evolve……..I remember 15 years ago, when I was a newie in training, it was all about check chains and being “dominant” over the dog and making sure the dog knew who was “boss” and if we didn’t the dog was just waiting to take over.
    we now know that dogs are not “plotting or waiting for the right moment to take over ” and that the so called pack structure is very fluid in the pet dog world depending on what particular resource is important to one dog at a given time. Something the DW show at this time does not recognise.

    The man that started the revolution in gentle reward based training is sadly retiring from the training world. Dr Ian Dunbar tried many times to get TV executives interested in a TV program on dog training for at least 30 years but as he explains it, the TV experts didn’t seem to think he had the charisma or TV appeal – how wrong they were, he is a fabulous speaker and also has authored many books.

    Perhaps CM fans should seek these books out and other fomrs of media, read, view or listen to them and then they will really be in the position to make a truely informed opinon -just as those of us who have in actual fact studied ALL factors and made the truely informed decision and opinon.

    Thank you for bringing to the attention of the world the potential harm that Caesar Milan does to the dog world in general and particularly to dogs.

    Gillian Shippen
    Adelaide SA
    Australia

  47. I don’t have a television, so I’ve only seen a few episodes of the dog whisperer; however, the manner in which his methods are described in this article seem a gross mischaracterization.

    From what I’ve seen, he encourages dog owners who rarely exercise their dogs to begin walking them everyday, which is good for the dog owner and the dog. I don’t walk my dogs to exhaustion, but I do notice that when they go out on hikes with me for twenty to sixty minutes a day, they are calmer and do not exhibit undesirable behaviors.

    Also, I have not seen him discourage positive social interactions with dogs, or use aversive-only techniques. What I have seen him do is tell people that they are too affectionate to the point of providing no boundaries to their dogs. I have heard him say that the dog should be invited into the owner’s space before being pet, held or otherwise rewarded, so that the human is in charge of that interaction rather than the dog imposing its will on the human. Again, boundaries.

    To note that behaviorists in the field would never use Millan’s techniques on wildlife is a logical fallacy. This straw man doesn’t hold up in light of the obvious differences in our millennia-old relationship with dogs. The way would be interact with a breed of lap-dog is going to be vastly different to the way we would treat a coyote in the high desert. The argument doesn’t make sense.

    Perhaps I am ignorant of all that Millan has claimed, but from a casual observation, I have seen none of the accusations made in this article to be accurate. While Millan has a distinct lack of brevity, uses the same language repeatedly without defining his terms and occasionally employs the technique of physically restraining a dog to show dominance, a technique I stopped using shortly after employing it for the first time, on the grounds that it just wasn’t effective, he doesn’t appear to promote any of the techniques stated in the article. I’ve seen him promote physical exercise, not exhaustion. I’ve heard him promote calm, assertiveness by only allowing dogs into your space when they are invited, not aversive-only techniques with no positive interactions.

    I would submit that what people here are collectively upset about is the ignorance of the viewer rather than the speaker, using techniques “administered by the owner, based on what they think that they know of the methods”. Perhaps that is more the fault of the way the techniques are being presented in twenty-minute episodes cut for television than the underlying message presented by Millan. Ultimately, he is responsible for the way his message is portrayed and can be faulted for that. Vilifying and even attempting to demonize (please, was it necessary to your argument to compare running with dogs to torturing terrorism suspects?) him with what I see as the false accusations and comparisons in this article, however, does not further the conversation.

    I may be betraying my ignorance of ethology, but I have reservations about a science based on human interpretation of behavior. While I see it as a valuable part of biology, a behaviorist-only approach to an understanding of an animal species, especially one as complex as the dog, ignoring thousands of years of co-existent evolution and the genetic effects of captive breeding for beneficial characteristics, seems short-sighted.

    In other words, there are critics of your methods as well, as there should be in any science. Writing of this sort does not further the scientific method. Based on what I’ve read from you today, I would say your methodology is about as sound as Cesar Millan’s.

  48. I am not a dog owner, but I am an animal lover, I have 4 cats. My observations on this debate seem to hinge around time. Do you have the time to work with your pets, find out what motivates them and set up positive reinforcement training; Or do you need to react quickly to situations.

    Time is a precious commodity you tell a client that they have to find several more hours out their busy day and the majority will probably look for a different method.

    A question for positive reinforcement advocates. You are meeting an adult dog for the 1st time (no history, no information whatsoever) you spot the signs that this dog is about to bite you; what do you do in that instant to calm the dog down and prevent it from biting you (without using any of the touching, kicking, leash control that Cesar uses)?

    Cesar popularity is based on having techniques to control the dog in that instant.

    For long term results and if you have the time, it seems that positive reinforcement training is a better method.

    Quick fixes often have their long term faults, but are chosen in a lot of cases.

  49. This is a situation I’m in FAR too often — not only with clients but daily on the street.

    A good trainer has studied and recognizes the early signs of stress, and manages the situation in order to relieve the dog’s stress and greatly reduce the chance of a bite. Using such a method shows respect for this other living creature, and gives the trainer the chance to show the dog an alternate option in that particular situation.

    Depending on the signs that the dog is showing, I may turn sideways, keep my back straight, offer some calming signals, play the ‘treat-retreat’ game, etc. There’s tons of ways to diffuse this sort of a situation.

    At no time would I touch or attempt to touch any dog who was obviously over threshold. That WOULD set him off and pretty much ‘force’ him to bite me in order to get relief from the situation. Contrary to popular television belief, most dogs really don’t want to bite any of us… and what happens? We push and push and push until they do, THEN we send them off to be euthanized.

    We can just as easily respond to what the dog is saying in the same amount of time that it takes to touch, kick or leash-jerk, with better results — no biting, and if the trainer is skilled in reading dogs, a reduction in stress and aggressive behavior. That reduction is just enough time to step in and start teaching the dog an alternate way of behaving.

    Unfortunately, we have to face facts: the above way is about as exciting as watching grass grow or paint dry… CM’s way is just so much more exciting to watch, oh so Mutual of Omaha Wild Kingdom!!!

  50. https://news.vin.com/VINNews.aspx?articleId=12230

    Veterinary Behaviorists Question Dominance Theory in Dogs
    February 5, 2009
    By: Timothy Kirn
    For The VIN News Service

    Cesar Millan, television’s ‘Dog Whisperer,’ has legions of fans, including some dog trainers. But a group of veterinary behaviorists is not among them.

    The American Veterinary Society of Animal Behavior (AVSAB) issued a new position paper aimed at countering some of the pervasive influence of his show, which airs on the National Geographic Channel, and of Millan’s training approach, which is based on what the position statement calls outdated dominance theory.

    “The AVSAB recommends that veterinarians not refer clients to trainers or behavior consultants who coach and advocate dominance hierarchy theory and the subsequent confrontational training that follows from it,” the position statement says.

    That statement was initiated with Millan in mind, says Dr. Laurie Bergman, of Norristown, Pa., a member of AVSAB’s executive board.

    “We had been moving away from dominance theory and punitive training techniques for a while, but, unfortunately, Cesar Millan has brought it back,” she says.

    Millan’s program began airing in September 2004. It has a large following and has twice been nominated for an Emmy Award for Outstanding Reality Program.

    On his show, Millan is invited into homes to work with incorrigible pooches, many that have failed with previous trainers. Usually, he identifies the problem and begins immediate remediation.

    He says he is really retraining the owners, not the dogs, and generally notes that his sessions are just a beginning. But he does read the dogs and responds to them with insight and intuition. He often is shown calming and subduing an animal in a short time with minimal effort, communicating with the animal mostly by gaze and posture. Sometimes, the results appear nothing short of miraculous.

    Dogs are pack animals and packs are ruled by a dominant alpha male, and that is the problem in the majority of unruly situations he addresses on the show, Milan says. The owners are either milquetoasts or inconsistent, and the dog is lost.

    “What I am doing is training the human to meet the needs of the dog,” he has stated. “So, by doing that, we are going to eliminate fear, anxiety and aggression.”

    Millan asserts himself with the dogs and uses a number of negative-reinforcement, or correction, techniques such as alpha rolls (the dog is rolled onto its back, a submissive position) and flooding (the dog is exposed to something that causes it anxiety and is not allowed to escape, to desensitize it).

    He also has been shown choking a dog on the end of a leash until it fell onto its side, gasping for air.

    That is the exactly the trouble with him, say the veterinarian behaviorists. His techniques are likely to have only a temporary effect and may be harmful in some instances.

    The American Humane Association sent a letter to National Geographic in 2006, complaining that Millan’s techniques were “cruel and dangerous.” The association asked that the program be removed from the airwaves.

    The AVSAB position statement says that the ideas that dogs act like pack animals and that packs have a strict, dominant alpha-dog hierarchy are erroneous.

    Dogs have lived with humans for 15,000 years, and they evolved as scavengers, not hunters. So it is not legitimate to compare dogs with wolves and wolf packs, which do hunt, according to the statement. The evolutionary pressure on dogs was that the least shy animals were the most successful in ransacking human refuse. Today’s free-roaming dogs live in small, less cohesive groups rather than packs and are often alone.

    Moreover, the notion that every pack has an aggressive alpha male that rules over all the others originated from observations of captive wolves. But, research on wild wolves suggests that wolf packs are not rigidly controlled by a single domineering male, according to L. David Mech, a senior scientist with the U.S. Geological Survey who has studied wild wolves in Michigan and Northern Minnesota for more than 40 years.

    Mech says a pack usually has an alpha pair and that most of the rest of the pack is that pair’s offspring. That means the lead male never fought for dominance but merely reproduced. The lead male does not always lead during hunts or in anything else for that matter.

    In fact, Mech says he generally objects to the term “alpha” male — a term he once used — because what it implies is not accurate.

    Dominance theory leads to an antagonistic relationship between human and pet and to negative and coercive training methods, the AVSAB statement says. A punishment approach can backfire.

    “It won’t change the underlying state of fear, so the fear will come out when the stimulus is no longer there,” says Dr. Sophia Yin, of the University of California-Davis and an AVSAB Executive Board member.

    Though Millan has been criticized by a number of different groups and individuals, he has supporters.

    A New Yorker profile published in 2006, compared Millan’s movements and posture to that of a dancer’s and described his ability to communicate with dogs as masterful. Because of the precision of those movements and the messages they convey, he was equated to a therapist who works with autistic children.

    “I have never seen Mr. Millan be abusive,” says Martin Deeley, executive director of the International Association of Canine Professionals.

    Millan does not use coercive techniques exclusively, but also uses positive reinforcement, says Deeley, who has worked with Millan and knows him well.

    That combination is what most trainers use today, Deeley says. For a while, the pendulum in training approach was swinging toward the exclusive use of positive reward, but now it is swinging back.

    “I think what people have found is that positive reinforcement and reward is not working with every dog,” he says. “I don’t think any dog can be trained using only positive reinforcement.”

    On the show, Millan says: “I always say my way is not the only way. It is just one way. The people that follow me feel that it works.”

    Deeley considers Millan’s instinctual rapport and ability to communicate with dogs astounding and says it is clear that he cares about dogs.

    Millan heads a foundation that supports shelters and rescue organizations across the country. Long before he was famous, Millan opened a center for abused and rescued dogs in a rough part of South Central Los Angeles. On his program, he’s shown taking walks with his pack of rescued dogs down the streets of South Central and in the mountains surrounding the city.

    “I have found his respect for the dogs and his love for the dogs is very great,” Deeley says.

    Heather Houlahan is another trainer who backs Millan’s techniques.

    “Demand for private dog training definitely increased in the two years after his show debuted, and many owners contacting me specifically cited Cesar Millan as inspiring them to do something about their dogs’ behavior,” says Houlahan, of Cranberry Township, Pa., who trains search-and-rescue dogs and works with seized dogs.

    Millan speaks in language that the average pet owner can understand, and what is particularly important, he shows the public that even a difficult dog can be taught, she says. The public, therefore, gets the message that training, done properly, will produce results.

    “Within the bounds of the medium — which is stupid — he shows results and he communicates well,” she says. “He uses plain English, which I believe is very important, and he is a very good chap with the dogs. I think the show has basically done good.”

    The AVSAB statement annoys Houlahan. She questions the science behind it and says dogs do exhibit dominance behavior and when they do, need to be corrected.

    “They are picking on Cesar Millan, but they are also picking on the entire community of results-based trainers,” she says.

    Yin and the AVSAB, however, believe Millan’s influence has led to a greater use of punitive training and to a misunderstanding of canine intent. Yin thinks his teachings lead the general public to view all canine misbehavior as dominance aggression, when that is not the case.

    The dog who fails to come when called is not exhibiting an intention to establish dominance over the caller. Rather, dominance behavior is “when animals use aggression for scarce resources,” Yin says. She is particularly troubled by Millan’s use of flooding. The technique is brutal, and it is not the way psychologists practice desensitization, she says. Real desensitization involves exposing the subject to the anxiety-producing stimulus in a gradual, controlled manner and is combined with positive reinforcement, she adds.

    “Since he has been using those techniques, they have become more popular with the general public,” she says.

    Yin wants veterinarians to warn dog owners to avoid any trainer who uses punitive techniques too heavily and advises practitioners to tell their clients to look for three signs that a trainer is too negative:

    1. The trainer continually tells owners that they have to be the “alpha.”

    2. The trainer warns owners not to use rewards too much. It is not rewards that are the problem but how they sometimes are not used correctly.

    3. In a class, more than 10 percent of the dogs are on pinch collars or shock collars. Shock collars should never be used as an initial training device, according to Yin.

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